Jump to content

This is TruthLoveEnergy: A Michael Teachings Collaborative Community - We are a collaborative community of studying, sharing, and archiving of The Michael Teachings as channeled through Troy Tolley since 1988.   BASIC INTRODUCTION

 

There are many SERVICES available - Order an Essence & Personality Profile, join a private Personal Open Floor chat with Michael, find out your 9 Pillars, discuss Past Lives, ask about relationships, and schedule time to discuss anything and everything with Michael through Troy.    SCHEDULE A SESSION

Do You Need SUPPORT? - Community Support and Official Support are available for members! Support Tickets receive responses as fast as we can, so please be patient. We are a very small team! Community Support is dependent upon member responses.   SUPPORT TICKETS COMMUNITY SUPPORT

Check out our ever-evolving LIBRARY? - Explore our archiving of decades worth of material channeled through Troy from Michael. This Library is a collaborative effort and shows the power of community.  STUDY LIBRARY

Learn More About Your HOST & CHANNELING - Learn more about Troy through his blog and feel free to ask him about anything related to his work as a channel! You will receive a response ASAP.   30 THINGS ABOUT TROY ASK THE CHANNEL TROY PLAYS GAMES

Membership Gratitude Event - March 8, 2017


Bobby
 Share

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, Bobby said:

Is "The Power of Positive Thinking" a book that resonates primarily with Baby Souls? What, if anything, can an Old Soul learn from this book?

 

In response to the first question: yes, and Young Souls. In response to the second question: very little.

 

This made me laugh.  Don't we all have to go up certain blind alleys others have glowingly recommended in order to find out what is true for us.  And for sure just because something may be old soul age appropriate doesn't mean it is for all old souls.

  • LIKE/LOVE 12
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • TeamTLE
10 minutes ago, Connor said:

Wow.

WOW.

Shackleton should have waited a century.

 

There is a plethora of conspiratorial youtube videos on Antarctic secrets but you know how those go.  It will be interesting to hear what else Michael can add to this :)

  • LIKE/LOVE 9
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Bobby said:

One of the more direct routes through this particular External Monad is to LET YOURSELF LOVE/LET YOURSELF BE LOVED.

 

This is not the same thing is being attached, owning, being owned, being stalked, etc.

 

Hopelessly Loving means that one is moving away from a distorted the concept of Love that depends on ownership and approval. Hopelessly Loved means that one is moving away from lack of boundaries and lack of capacity to say No.

 

So if the Hopelessly Loving can transform the concept of "love" into a valid Love, the pain shifts into deep gratitude.

 

If the Hopelessly Loved can confidently say No and walk away so that the Hopelessly Loved regains his or her sense of self, the drain can shift into good will.

 

I like this because even if not in that particular monad it still works for anything.  I have been kind of wishy washy on my "no's".  Hopelessly loving has been great for the music business.

 

  • LIKE/LOVE 7
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, I hope humanity's deep shit turns into this deep shift before Antarctica melts entirely, because then it would just become another place to mess up, and inhabit. I don't know why, but I have this deep love for Antarctica as it is now, as if it were a bit sacred, and I really don't want to see that messed with. (Just thinking about this made me cry.)

Maxim, that "very little" was amusing for me, too! For some reason I also half-expected Michael to answer Maureen's question about Gurdjieff's Enneagram with: "Oh, he just made those up, they mean nothing" :)

 

P.S. Nicely caught and good question, Bobby!

Edited by Evelin
  • LIKE/LOVE 7
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • TLE12
6 hours ago, Evelin said:

Well, I hope humanity's deep shit turns into this deep shift before Antarctica melts entirely, because then it would just become another place to mess up, and inhabit. I don't know why, but I have this deep love for Antarctica as it is now, as if it were a bit sacred, and I really don't want to see that messed with. (Just thinking about this made me cry.)

Maxim, that "very little" was amusing for me, too! For some reason I also half-expected Michael to answer Maureen's question about Gurdjieff's Enneagram with: "Oh, he just made those up, they mean nothing" :)

 

P.S. Nicely caught and good question, Bobby!

 

LOL Evelin! Same.  As a kid I was fascinated by Antarctica...magnificent, still, and free from us.  But if it's meant for our evolution...  I hope a team of conscious, awesome scientists make the discovery. 

 

Very interesting questions, thank you guys : )

Edited by Rosario
  • LIKE/LOVE 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Maureen: Michael, I’m curious as to how the Michael Teachings fits into Gurdjieff’s teachings specifically around the Enneagrams, just for today, as I think this is a rather large subject.

Maureen: The 9 Enneagram types are The Reformer, The Helper, The Achiever, The Individualist, The Investigator, The Loyalist, The Enthusiast, The Challenger, The Peacemaker.

Maureen: I think that by Gurdjieff working with 9 rather than 7 his teaching the Enneagram may fall into the category Michael mentioned in the Nine Karmic Sequences Michael Speaks as Gurdjieff’s whole teaching was about "one's independent self-development"

Maureen: MEntity said: “The significance of NINE is part of the consistency of what sets of factors or elements do for the fragment evolving. … 9 is a set of factors that are about one's independent self-development, such as the 9 Needs, 9 Karmic Sequences, 9 Pillars. … This must be, can be, and will be fulfilled by the individual, regardless of any relationship or circumstance, and often do not require many resources to do so.”

 

We tried to convey with greater clarity the Roles at the time, but his fascination with geometry overrode our communication and the Enneagram took the focus. We tried to convey that an octave is a pattern of evolution that is an overlapping cycle of progress and comprehension and that this applies to nearly every dimension of existence, but the fascination with the teaching around the self-sustaining factors of 9 that are necessary in a more specific context became the focus.

 

The Enneagram cannot be correlated to the Heptagram or superimposed because George's Enneagram includes two additional positions to "fill in the gap." We can roughly correlate the Roles with the Enneagram, but the characteristics of one Role are diffused across two Enneagram positions. The additional positions that George felt were necessary were symbolic of the positions of Guides.

 

We suggest exploring these as separate systems, however, there is great validity in this system if it is seen in terms of how one participates in a society.

 

Maureen: Would you list how the Roles "fit" into the Enneagram, with the Guide positions?

 

We convey this only with your understanding that a forced correlation is at work here:

 

1 - PRIEST, 2 - SERVER, 3 - GUIDE, 4 - ARTISAN, 5 - SCHOLAR, 6 - (originally a guide position, now Warrior), 7 - SAGE, 8 - KING, 9 - (originally Warrior position, now Guide).

 

The positions of 3 and 6 were the "gaps" he felt were important to fill in, but over time the associations shifted for reasons of logic and conveniences.

 

The concept of guides was never fully realized into the map because societal roles were the focus.

 

TIMOTHY SAYS: 

 ME's advice "We suggest exploring these as separate systems..." is pertinent here on this subject of the ENNEAGRAM, and the enneatypes as they have been known. The origin and story of Enneagram/Enneatypes is way more complex than most people are aware, and there is some mis-information as well. 

 

I have been studying, following & trying to validate the various threads related to the ENNEAGRAM since 1968 when first discovering/reading Gurdjieff/Ouspensky's writings, and subsequently every other related writing from that "lineage" (all the students of Gurdjieff that wrote books, especially JG Bennett.) There is no written record of the enneatypes as relates to the various books that have appeared since the 80's, 90's and since in the Gurdjieff corpus. Gurdjieff/Ouspenky speak only of Chief Features, and even then this was NOT related to the Enneagram, as he/they taught it.

 

The Enneatypes, or what has become know as the Enneagram System of personality types comes from Oscar Ichazo and the Arica system. This was first (partially) presented in Arica, Chile in 1968, publicly, and then to a group of American students including, noteably, Claudio Naranjo and John Lilly, as part of a training, which subsequently began the ARICA School, later (1970) in New York, and all over the US and Canada. I joined that school in 1974, and studied that entire system from 1974 to 1996.

 

Now, to make things complicated, when Claudio Naranjo returned to the US in 1969, he started a group, SAT, and began teaching much of what he learned from Ichazo in ARICA and Santiago, Chile. Claudio had 'worked' with Ichazo on the system and he elaborated the enneatypes, or what Ichazo called the Ego Fixations, more along the lines of his psychoanalytic training. In that SAT group, in 1969-71 were some people who would then take those teaching and create their own 'teachings' based on Claudio's understandings, including Helen Palmer, Richard Rohr,  Sandra Maitri and A.H. Almaas. These people were completely separate from Ichazo and the ARICA school.  Virtually all the books that have appeared on the Enneagram system of personality derive from these people. There is/was no direct connection to the Gurdjieff system of Chief Features, and only a partial understanding of the system of Ichazo. 

 

Ichazo (and the Arica School) continued to teach and elaborate that system separately, and semi-privately (no publications) through the 70's and 80's to the present day. It's a VAST system, and the Ego Fixations, are only a fraction of it. I studied and participated in the trainings and teachings until about 2000.

 

ME is accurate (in my understanding) that the Enneatypes relates more to how personality manifests socially, or intra and inter psychically. (I could elaborate, but it would take volumes!!) In the ARICA system everyone has ALL the enneatypes nascent within the psyche, but is "fixated" in one pattern, which dominates his life, hence the resonance with "chief feature."  

 

It seems that it is Ichazo that focuses more on the 9 rather than the 7 (or octave). I don't see Gurdjieff ( nothing written) paying as much attention to 9, as a spectrum  of 'types.' Whereas, Ichazo elaborates a whole system of enneagrams based on 9. Also, Ichazo describes a whole different set of laws based on the enneagram. He also describes many other geometric aspects, the pentad, hexad, etc. almost a new Pythagorean system. Also Ichazo's system includes an entire Tantric approach to meditation which although unique in many ways, follows the Tibetan tantric traditions, in essence. 

Ichazo, of course, knew of the Gurdjieff work very well, but went on his own "journey in search of remarkable men" and indeed,

contacted many of the Gurdjieff sources...and much more besides. (A whole other story.) 

  

 

Needless to say, I do see a "resonance" among the enneatypes, as understood generally, and the roles. 

In the Enneatype format, I resonate most with the 4 with strong influences to 5 and 3. 

My ROLE is scholar, priest cast, with Artisan ET.  

 

The apparent 'confusion' in the ME reading, may be due to the general lack of "public" knowledge about how this all came about. 

There's a lot more I could say on the subject, but that's it for now.  

 

 

 

    

 

 

 

 

Edited by Timothy J Sullivan
  • LIKE/LOVE 9
  • THANK YOU! 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank you for bringing up that question about the Enneagram, @Maureen.  This was one of the first systems with which I got acquainted  in the beginning of my search for knowledge about the different ways people function and appear in society.

 

I can definitely see similarities between some aspects of the MT and the Enneagram. Similarly to how here we have Roles that are on the Emotional, Intellectual and Action Axis, there the types are classified as belonging to different Centers-Feeling, Thinking and Instinctive (the last one would translate to Action in MT terminology).

 

Every Enneagram type has its own specific fear which relates to the Chief Features.

 

There are different levels of development-a type can be unhealthy, average or healthy which corresponds to the positive and the negative poles.

 

In the Enneagram there is a wing system.  The wing is considered to be the second side to the personality and it reminds me of Casting. A Server-Cast Priest would be a 1w2 in the Enneagram. However, I am in disagreement with the fact that in the wing system you can pair a type only with the one that preceeds it and with the other that follows it. For example, if you're a five you can only be either a 5w4 or a 5w6 and this seems limiting to me. There's more to the wing theory but this is what I'll say for now.

 

And finally, the instinctual drives in the Enneagram can be correlated to Centering. Self-Preservational-Moving,  Sexual-Emotional and Social-Intellectual.

 

Aside from this subject, I wonder if there is any validity to the MBTI system. Things there appear to be all over the place with 16 personality types. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Marigold
  • LIKE/LOVE 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 hours ago, Evelin said:

Well, I hope humanity's deep shit turns into this deep shift before Antarctica melts entirely, because then it would just become another place to mess up, and inhabit. I don't know why, but I have this deep love for Antarctica as it is now, as if it were a bit sacred, and I really don't want to see that messed with. (Just thinking about this made me cry.)


We have to make sure Antarctica stays frozen!  Without the bitter cold there, what will contain the Thing when it lands on Earth and prevent it from infecting all life on the planet? ?

Edited by Sam K
  • LIKE/LOVE 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for the enneagram update, @Timothy J Sullivan.  Scholar you must be.  I had heard a much more condensed version along those lines.  Gurdjief said something like all knowledge was contained in the enneagram... the geometric figure.... and so the one time I took LSD I gazed at it for a while.  Nothing happened.

  • LIKE/LOVE 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • TeamTLE
On 3/8/2017 at 7:39 PM, Janet said:

I was pretty sure I had been in a session where Michael spoke of Antarctica before. I found it in the Fringe and Whackadoodle section: 

Ancient Civilizations

 

I still can't wrap my head around a few things.  In order for a civilization to have thrived in Antarctica, was it positioned in a different place?  I'm familiar with the theory of Pangea but its breakup supposedly happened over 200 million years ago... well before any transfers here from Sirius.

 

If it is basically in the same spot now as it was when these civilizations thrived there, what was going on with the planet's climate that enabled people to live there?  Being at the extreme south pole of the Earth, unless the axial shift changed, Antarctica would still have received 6 months of daylight followed by 6 months of darkness... hardly conditions for a civilization to thrive.

 

And if the climate was so much milder than it is now to enable civilization to thrive there, what was going on with the planet that brought this about?  Are we going back to those conditions?  If so, why is that a negative thing?

  • LIKE/LOVE 6
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • TeamTLE
2 minutes ago, Troy said:

You guys miss the Fringe chats, huh.

 

At least enough for an infrequent session... maybe once per quarter or something?  ;)

  • LIKE/LOVE 9
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • HOST & RESIDENT CHANNEL

RE: origins of Enneagram... kudos to @Timothy J Sullivan for the background!! Thanks! I apologize for any misinformation in the channeling. I know there is controversy over the origins of the Enneagram. I think Michael has always said Gurdjieff was exploring the meaning of 9 and its place in his system, but I don't think Michael has ever addressed the actual gap (or bridge) between Gurdjieff and the eventual Enneagram that we know today. There was a lot of what Gurdjieff taught and explored that was only handed down verbally, and I think this contributed to the controversy of origins and made all of that room for others to finalize the meaning of the Enneagram.

  • LIKE/LOVE 7
Link to comment
Share on other sites

59 minutes ago, Troy said:

RE: origins of Enneagram... kudos to @Timothy J Sullivan for the background!! Thanks! I apologize for any misinformation in the channeling. I know there is controversy over the origins of the Enneagram. I think Michael has always said Gurdjieff was exploring the meaning of 9 and its place in his system, but I don't think Michael has ever addressed the actual gap (or bridge) between Gurdjieff and the eventual Enneagram that we know today. There was a lot of what Gurdjieff taught and explored that was only handed down verbally, and I think this contributed to the controversy of origins and made all of that room for others to finalize the meaning of the Enneagram.

 

Yes, Troy, much of what Gurdjieff knew was handed down orally which does indeed complicate the issue. Perhaps Michael can clarify if specific questions were asked. The Enneagram itself, not the enneatypes per say, but the diagram/graph, has been explored by other's following on from the way Gurdjieff explained it as a "process tool" or way of understanding how things function in nature, or the cosmos. The law of seven and the law of three, for example. I know of several lines of inquiry on that 'thread.'

 

It would be interesting to know when, where, how the Enneagram itself appeared, historically, prior to Gurdjieff. Was it known in prior civilizations, or time eras. And what's the 'future' of this mysterious Symbol/Graph/Diagram. I myself am totally FASCINATED!  

 

Here's a tid bit...I learned a way to inscribe the Enneagram lines into an Icosahedron, which makes it appear in 3-dimensions within the 12-point 'sphere' of the icosahedral form, which kinda integrates "12" with "9."  Fascinating!  

  • LIKE/LOVE 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • TeamTLE
1 hour ago, Bobby said:

 Being at the extreme south pole of the Earth, unless the axial shift changed

 

Edgar Cayce was the teacher that first introduced me to reincarnation, and he predicted massive earth changes, including a pole shift. I remember being a little alarmed as a teenager by some of his predictions, which were supposed to occur by 1998. So I did some research about pole shifts, and they do happen with regularity, but usually it's a swap of polarity rather than the pole actually moving somewhere else dramatically. I did find this article that ties changes in the poles to climate change: NASA: Earth's poles are tipping thanks to climate change. So, it could be that Antarctica's climate was different because the poles were in a different place. 

 

1 hour ago, Bobby said:

In order for a civilization to have thrived in Antarctica, was it positioned in a different place?

 

More likely it's the movement out of Pangea that caused the changes that made Antarctica very cold. Antarctica was part of Gondwana, the southern part of Pangea. I found interest articles on a site called livescience.com. An article about Gondwana says: "During Gondwana's stint as the southerly supercontinent, the planet was much warmer than it was today — there was no Antarctic ice sheet, and dinosaurs still roamed the Earth. By this time, it was the Jurassic Period, and much of Gondwana was covered with lush rainforest."

 

Another article about Antarctica's Lambert Graben valley says: "Lambert Graben formed during the breakup of Gondwana, an ancient supercontinent, a process that happened in stages. Antarctica, India and Africa tore apart in the Late Cretaceous (about 80 million years ago). The split created long, linear valleys oriented perpendicular to the continental coastlines. At the time, Earth's climate was warmer than it is today, and as Antarctica moved southward, settling into its home over the South Pole, the continent teemed with plants and animals."

  • LIKE/LOVE 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 hours ago, Janet said:

More likely it's the movement out of Pangea that caused the changes that made Antarctica very cold. Antarctica was part of Gondwana, the southern part of Pangea. I found interest articles on a site called livescience.com. An article about Gondwana says: "During Gondwana's stint as the southerly supercontinent, the planet was much warmer than it was today — there was no Antarctic ice sheet, and dinosaurs still roamed the Earth. By this time, it was the Jurassic Period, and much of Gondwana was covered with lush rainforest."

 

Another article about Antarctica's Lambert Graben valley says: "Lambert Graben formed during the breakup of Gondwana, an ancient supercontinent, a process that happened in stages. Antarctica, India and Africa tore apart in the Late Cretaceous (about 80 million years ago). The split created long, linear valleys oriented perpendicular to the continental coastlines. At the time, Earth's climate was warmer than it is today, and as Antarctica moved southward, settling into its home over the South Pole, the continent teemed with plants and animals."

 

Janet, if I recall from plate tectonics, Australia and India were also once part of Antarctica near the South Pole. One of the other contributing factors was the development of the Antarctic Circumpolar Current, which begun development around 33.5 million years ago when Australia split away, and roughly the same time period (geologically speaking) when the Drake Passage between Antarctica and South America opened up. The ocean current keeps the warm waters away from Antarctica to help maintain it's ice. Still, Homo sapiens have only been around for about 200,000 years, and from what Michael has said, we've been ensouled in various predecessor species since about 6 million years ago. The place was frozen long before we arrived :) I think Bobby wants to go get his stash that he left there in a previous life :)

  • LIKE/LOVE 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yeah, the Antarctic thing seems bogus to me. I wasn't able to get to the reference someone posted, but the idea that NASA has something that could find the traces of a civilization under a kilometer or more of ice is nothing short of preposterous.

 

If something's buried under a glacier, nothing is going to be left. The glacier moves, and it takes whatever is on the surface with it. That surface will be scoured clean over a period of time.

 

Michael is not omniscient. They have to research the Akashic Records link by link, and if they don't get out of fringe and conspiracy theory territory before they call a halt to the search, well, you'll get a read on what's circulating on the fringe.

  • LIKE/LOVE 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you Google about what's underneath the Antarctic ice, you get everything from UFOs (eh...) to gravitational anomalies from fallen asteroids (maybe?) to actual lakes: this article was sort of interesting. Not that there's anything about technology there, but it does show that the area under the ice might not be scrubbed clean.

  • LIKE/LOVE 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/9/2017 at 2:33 PM, Bobby said:

Bobby: Is there some sort of technology for discovery in waiting located there that may be beneficial to us and our near future that may have originated from our past or even from those off planet?

 

Yes. Advanced technologies that surpass current understanding of both technology and history are likely unearthing in this region, eventually, if not already. We think any discovery made in this regard would be tied to the Vector in place regarding a global shift around 2020.

 

The technologies are both from Human history and off-planet gifting.

 

 

 

Wow! I hope that there are caretaking Old and Mature souls in charge of this. I too would be seriously pissed off if a bunch of Trumpsupporting arseholes managed to exploit and ruin this land. It is a special land and needs to be treated very carefully with a lot of respect. Sarah's posted article was interesting, finding ATP in the life under Lake Whillans in Antarctica. Some more information on this discovery would be great, if it can be accessed prior to the actual discovery.

  • LIKE/LOVE 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/11/2017 at 0:54 PM, John Roth said:

Yeah, the Antarctic thing seems bogus to me. I wasn't able to get to the reference someone posted, but the idea that NASA has something that could find the traces of a civilization under a kilometer or more of ice is nothing short of preposterous.

 

If something's buried under a glacier, nothing is going to be left. The glacier moves, and it takes whatever is on the surface with it. That surface will be scoured clean over a period of time.


Not necessarily.  For one thing, whatever may be found is not necessarily directly beneath the ice sheet.  Antarctica has extensive mountain ranges, much of which rise partially above the ice.  In addition, Michael said that whatever's there will "surpass current understandings of technology and history."  Something that advanced could perhaps be resilient enough to withstand the glacial movement, or be otherwise shielded from it somehow.

I'm not saying you're wrong to be skeptical, of course, just that it's not entirely implausible that something like that could be found on Antarctica.  It depends on the nature of the object discovered and the exact location postulated.

Edited by Sam K
  • LIKE/LOVE 6
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • TLE12
On 3/11/2017 at 10:54 AM, John Roth said:

Michael is not omniscient. They have to research the Akashic Records link by link, and if they don't get out of fringe and conspiracy theory territory before they call a halt to the search, well, you'll get a read on what's circulating on the fringe.

 

I can see your point about the unlikelihood of finding something under the ice, but this comment doesn't sound right. The Akashic Records aren't Internet links, they're records of Essences' experiences. I imagine the records of someone who made stuff up would be very different from the records of someone who actually did something in Antarctica. It's more likely that the channeling could be off than Michael not have enough time to read the records. 

Edited by DianeHB
  • LIKE/LOVE 6
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • HOST & RESIDENT CHANNEL

YAY! Thank you guys for being skeptical and on your toes. To me, in my line of work, the only thing worse than bad channeling is any channeling (good or bad) being believed without question. So thanks for the follow up comments and questions and input. I'm always open to any corrections or reigning in of inaccurate or just bad channeling, so I appreciate all of this follow up.

 

Based on what I'm reading in the channeling and what I'm reading in the comments:

 - I don't think I've seen Michael talking about anything just below the surface of the ice.

- I don't think Michael said that we would find a working technology intact and ready to activate.

- Though it's true that ice shifts and grinds, wouldn't it be possible for large chunks of land/ice to remain intact even as it may be a part of the shifts and grinding?

- Haven't we already found huge deposits of fossilized dinosaurs and forests?

- Even if a civilization were ground up, wouldn't it be feasible that the pieces are preserved, identifiable and intact?

 

Just some thoughts...

  • LIKE/LOVE 8
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...